Ryan Haynes, lead consultant at hospitality consultancy Haynes MarComs Limited, talks with host Robin Trimingham about strategies for evaluating existing supplier relationships and how to go about sourcing new vendors to improve operational efficiency, which can increase the quality of the guest experience.
Highlighting the importance of considering not just what a vendor supplies a property, but also whether these products and services are meeting the needs of the employees and guests in the best way possible, Haynes makes recommendations for evaluating the types and levels of support that a vendor offers. He also points out that it is equally important to understand how a vendor intends to keep pace with the rapid rate of change currently taking place within the global hospitality and tourism industry.
Highlights from Today’s Episode
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Ryan Haynes: [00:00:00] Relationships with existing systems. And this is a big thing. Every hotelier I speak to today says integrations, integrations, integrations. If your system does not integrate, what’s the point? And that is really key. Make sure that it either integrates with your existing systems or if you’re planning on changing your systems, that they integrate with one another.
Robin Trimingham: [00:00:30] Welcome to the Innovative Hotelier podcast by Hotels magazine, with weekly, thought-provoking discussions with the world’s leading hotel and hospitality innovators. Welcome to the Innovative Hotelier, brought to you by Hotels magazine. I’m your host, Robin Trimingham. As we all know, a hotel’s overall financial and guest experience success is closely tied to how well it manages its vendor relationships. Make the right relationships, and you can control purchasing costs, maintain inventory control, minimize waste, and most importantly, deliver a consistent guest experience. Make the wrong choices, however, and you don’t just impact forecasting and profitability, you risk disappointing guests, which can have long term consequences. So how then, do you go about correctly identifying vendors and establishing relationships that benefit your hotel operation and the guests you serve? My guest today, Ryan Haynes, lead consultant at Haynes Marcoms Limited, is here today to offer insights and ideas for evaluating both existing and new tech vendor relationships. Join me now for my conversation with Ryan. F4, which is a global food service and hospitality company that manufactures smart commercial grade solutions. Headquartered in Miami, the company designs and manufactures all their restaurant and hotel products. They have showrooms and distribution centers located throughout the globe, and their products are always in stock and ready to ship from any of their distribution centers worldwide. Welcome, Ryan. Thanks so much for taking time to chat with me today.
Ryan Haynes: [00:02:31] Thanks for reaching out. I’m really excited to have this conversation with you.
Robin Trimingham: [00:02:35] Well, I think this is going to help a lot of hoteliers, particularly the small independents and boutique operators. Obviously, this podcast is going to have mostly existing hoteliers who are listening, and they’re going to already have a whole pile of existing vendor relationships. But let’s face it, after what the world’s been through, the state of everybody’s vendor relationships is a really mixed bag between the ones that are working and the ones that were wondering what to do about. So let’s start there. When we think about the existing relationships, how do you establish a set of criteria for evaluating or figuring out which ones are working?
Ryan Haynes: [00:03:26] Let me start off by giving you a bit of context as to why I’m doing this. I think in the first place here, really to bridge that gap between buyers and sellers. As you say, it’s such a complex world with technology. How do you identify the systems that are actually going to work for your hotel? So we really need more open discussions around the different system solutions to help further the industry. And I think we’ve seen that, particularly in recent years, where we’ve seen much more development with integrations between systems and APIs. And this is one really key area that the industry as a whole needs to benefit from, and particularly for small independent hotels. And as you say, investment in technology is essential today. So for a hotelier, they need to make sure they’re getting the most bang for their buck from every single system. So the three key areas that I look at, particularly with our suppliers and when I speak to hoteliers, is firstly hotel users who’s using the system. How are they using the system? Is it actually easy for them to use, or is it actually quite a hindrance to the day to day activity particularly, where does it do you see it saving time and where are you starting to see it cause a friction? Because as you start to add more and more technology, you need to make sure that each of them is connected to your wider technology stack. And if there’s a lot of data manual input, that’s not a fun job for any of us. And I’m sure that we can all go back to the beginning of our careers, when we were sat there on the spreadsheet and having to pick up pieces of paper and enter that data.
Ryan Hanes: [00:04:54] Now you’ve got interns and graduate trainees entering roles, and they’re going there rather than picking up pieces of paper, they’re going from one system to another system, and that’s not really a good use of time. So what are the usage levels of the systems, and are they actually delivering for your team and helping support the overall performance of the hotel? Secondly, your suppliers, what is the level of support that they have there in place? How responsive are they and do you need to really identify what works for you and your team? We know that some people will want to pick up the phone and have a conversation. Others will just want to use a ticketing system. So what works for your team and expand your supplier? Actually offer this. And then the other side for the supplier is their product development. Is it expanding the features and functionalities? Because at the end of the day, you can’t be stuck with one system. Everything evolves as we’ve seen over the last few years, digitalization being a huge word. You’ve got to look at what that means for your hotel. And then finally around the product itself. And we’ve talked about the usability, but what level of training is there really required for your staff if you’re onboarding new team members, as we’ve had to see over the last few years due to staff shortages, how much time and energy and investment is that taking up before you then have to retrain or bring on a whole new team of people? So the better that the systems are performing in a way that is really intuitive, will really allow your systems to help you as a hotel grow and develop and be more effective.
Robin Trimingham: [00:06:24] I think you’re making some excellent points there. I mean, of course, I’ve worked for some enormous brands along the way, and in that scenario, typically there’s a guy or it could be a girl, of course, in a glass box who lives in the loading dock. And I’m thinking about all the physical supplies at this point, not just so much the technology suppliers, but there is stuff perpetually coming in the loading dock. And it’s a really laborious process because even when there’s technology involved, somebody still has to look over the manifest and the what’s arrived and marry up the two. So I think that how user friendly is the system and how well is it connected to the rest of the hotel? I think that’s a critical part. So how would you then say that hoteliers should handle the ongoing oversight of their vendors? Who in the property is going to be responsible for overseeing all of this? Are you going to handle this on a department by department basis, or is this going to be like one person’s job because they’re a detail person and they’re going to do it better?
Ryan Haynes: [00:07:40] I would say everybody needs to be involved in this, and you need to bring everybody into it. Today. Technology is in every aspect of everything that we do, and so every team member will have a responsibility to use it in some way. So you being sure about how confident they feel in using it, it just helps you better understand whether it’s the right system and tool for you. So guess from a perspective of looking at it from your team, ensure that day to day user reports go to their manager, explain some of the difficulties and the successes that they’re having with the systems. Make sure it’s part of the regular appraisals and check ups with your team. Is there any friction there? What is it enabled you to do better, particularly as well if you brought on a new system or a new features and functionalities has been released? Because I think that you need to take that from the bottom up, and you also need to take that from the top down. And the more that that’s communicated and explained and educated throughout the business, the better it is. You can really see the performance as a whole of the systems. Then there’s always going to be one person that needs to oversee this, someone who is the captain of the ship. And it depends on the size of your hotel, really, and the resources and access to talent you have.
Ryan Haynes: [00:08:51] Some hotels will be the general manager and with the general manager. If you’re not literate and don’t know the complexities of it all, working closely with a consultant, that being you may have an IT director on house or as part of your portfolio, so ensure that they’re reviewing the overall environment and the tech stack. Does it work for the type and size of your hotel and the structure that you’re trying to operate in? Because it’s going to be different if you’re a small, independent boutique hotel. First is a large beach resort, and the types of services that you’re providing your customers and your guests. And at the end of the day, it’s all about profitability as well. What is commercial bottom line? So your commercial director needs to be overlooking the performance of these systems. So when it comes to department by department, because of the way that systems now are evolving and that they do have many touch points across a hotel, you should be having cross departmental meetings to really help identify where the duplications of efforts are. Maybe you’ve got tools that are actually doing the same thing and you could just use one. And this is where I think would really help both save on time efficiencies and the number of vendors you’re using, and then reduce the investment you need to make.
Robin Trimingham: [00:10:04] I think you’re making a whole pile of interesting points there. I’m going to start with your last point, because when you have multiple systems in a property, some hotels will take the approach that, oh, well, the way to glue everything together is with an Excel spreadsheet and an oversight person who’s taking data from different systems, from different departments and entering it into a master spreadsheet. And I was talking about this with another guest yesterday. That’s not really the best approach in this modern era. There are brand new products and systems that are capable of seamlessly integrating all of this stuff. The other really important thing you were touching on is I think there is a huge difference between a vendor relationship with the guy who supplies the cheese, and a vendor relationship with the guy who’s supplying some sort of IT product when the cheese doesn’t show up three weeks in a row. You’re highly motivated to do something about that vendor relationship, because the lack of that product is going to show up immediately to the guest. There’s going to be a huge reaction chain all through the system. Our IT stuff on the other side, hoteliers tend to cling to their legacy systems and think it really is not the best idea anymore. So how often would you recommend reviewing or auditing your vendor relationships to avoid clinging to things that don’t serve you anymore?
Ryan Haynes: [00:11:46] Yes, absolutely. Every different system will have a different way in which you work with them. For example, there, it depends on the length of contract sometimes you have in place, because some contracts can be fixed for up to 5 to 7 years, which is a huge lifetime when you think of it to a hotel and what we can see change in 5 to 7 years. But what I think is really important is that you, from the outset, you set those objectives and goals. What is it you want this system to do and how is it meant to impact the property? And with that, identify what is going to be the key areas you need to monitor. So initially, when you engage a new supplier and know that some of your some of your listeners will have not necessarily brought in a new supplier. But if you have brought in a new supplier, check their performance over a 3 to 6 month trial period or pilot it, because a lot of systems will be more than willing to do this with you. There may be an expense, but it’s worth having that conversation and being open and transparent about why it’s essential that you go through this process. Quarterly performance checks, annual reviews, both internally, but also with your supplier because they need to see how you’re using the tool.
Ryan Haynes: [00:12:59] This gives you a great chance to give them feedback. At the end of the day, as a customer, you are a key stakeholder and therefore you need to be contributing to the performance of the overall product and their product delivery. So ensuring that you have that account manager who’s going to sit with you on a quarterly basis and an annual basis to see how that’s worked. Setting your team may be tasked to periodically benchmark suppliers in the market. There’s always new people coming out, but we’re seeing the legacy systems as well. They are diversifying. They’re bringing out new features and functionality. Some of them are massively investing in different areas of technology. So how is that going to help you better understand the value you’re getting from your existing supplier? And then finally and by no means least important, but it’s your industry peers have conversations with them. Go to events and conferences, phone up the other local hoteliers and find out what sorts of systems that they’re using and if they’ve brought anything on recently that they are showing is proving worth the investment, because that will really help you understand if you’re getting the best deal. And when I say best deal, it’s the value to draw from it for your property.
Robin Trimingham: [00:14:13] Well, you’re making a very interesting point, because one of the favorite things to do in some hotels is to gather for a cup of coffee and complain about the system, but nobody really seems to be doing anything proactive about fixing it, improving it, talking to the vendor, what you’re basically saying is that this is a situation where you’re either part of the solution or you’re part of the problem. So, okay, you’ve identified an actual problem with a system. How do you go about addressing this with the vendor? What are your recommendations?
Ryan Haynes: [00:14:58] Well, as part of the buying process, and even if you’ve just come on board with the hotel and you are now responsible, make sure that one of your key things is to have a phone call with the account director to really set out what your objectives and goals are, because that is what you’re working towards, and that’s why you’re using the system. And that will help you better understand perhaps where the issues lie, or for them to understand where the issues lie. Set timelines. That is really essential. Everything from the implementation of the product to training and activation or resolving a problem. Make sure you’re clear from their side what they’re going to do and what role you have to play to make sure that you resolve those problems. Regular check in calls, particularly with your account director, and asking again for those performance reviews, particularly during the point of the issue, maybe on a weekly basis or every couple of weeks, dependent on how pertinent that issue is, if it’s affecting your bottom line. It’s a daily report. You want to know why and how that’s going to be rectified, so you can manage that for yourselves. And who is there a customer support line that you can call?
Robin Trimingham: [00:16:04] Hotels with real people at the other end? I mean.
Ryan Haynes: [00:16:07] As you say, we are a 24 over seven 365 industry. So if the night porter or the night staff need to contact someone, is there someone there? And with the fact that teams change, just shift work. You need to make sure that the information is being passed on. So it’s essential that there are people to talk to. I’d say today even more so. So just make sure you raise those issues as soon as they arise, so that you can work in partnership with your supplier to a resolution.
Robin Trimingham: [00:16:36] Yeah. I think this is particularly essential when you’re a boutique operator, to ask the vendor about how often they do bug reporting, upgrades, patches, fixes, whatever the vendor is calling it, and if you’re doing your part. I mean, how do you finally identify when a supplier really needs to go?
Rayn Haynes: [00:17:02] I would say if it’s costing you more money than you’re necessarily making. And when I say that that return of investment is not necessarily just about finance, it’s about time. Are you requiring to also hire multiple additional people to actually manage the system, and it’s not delivering you any further savings? I mean, we take an example, say for example, the revenue management system. So now there can be a commercial financial return there in a sense of how it can maximise your rates across every single day. And then look at that demand. But then there’s a huge time saving aspect to it, because it can automate a lot of those processes. You’re not having to gather the data, crunch the numbers, and come up with a calculation of what the rates need to be on a daily basis or an hourly basis. And then finally, is that booking conversion, how is it also impacting the guest experience and that satisfaction level at the end of the day. So there are multiple metrics that you might look at. There. So we’re looking at finance. We’re looking at team time savings and we’re looking at guest satisfaction. So metrics need to be based on the areas in where that particular solution is going to have an impact on the business.
Robin Trimingham: [00:18:17] Yeah I think that’s really good advice. Established in 2002, is a woman owned global food service and hospitality company that manufactures smart, savvy commercial grade products, including plateware drinkware flatware. Hotel amenities and more. Driven by innovation, F.o.h. Is dedicated to delivering that wow experience that restaurants and hotels crave, all while maintaining a competitive price. All products are fully customizable, and many are also created using sustainable, eco friendly materials such as straws and plates made from biodegradable paper and wood, and PVC free drinkware. F.o.h. Has to establish brands front of the house, focused on tabletop and buffet solutions, and room 360, which offers hotel products. Check out their collections today at F.o.h worldwide.com. We’re looking for new suppliers. Where do you start? Particularly in the IT world where there’s a new AI, something or other being launched every week? How in the world do you begin the process of searching and identifying who might be right for you?
Ryan Haynes: [00:19:38] Yes, we can easily be distracted by all these wonderful, flashy lights that are coming up in and around us. And they have squishy toys. I know, and you see some of the trade shows and you get some suppliers. You have so many gimmicks and it’s also exciting. But at the end of the day, don’t forget what is your strategy and what is your budget? You’ve got to focus on that to begin with, because there’s no point in going for a whole new system or supplier to deliver you something that you cannot live out. At the end of the day, it’s a waste of money. Look at the strategy and budget. Bring your team in. That’s really important, right? Team morale, actually them investing and believing in these systems rather than you dumping a system on them and expecting them to enjoy it. That is the worst. I’m sure all of us have been through that experience in the last 20 years, where suddenly we come in and we’re given a whole new system that we have to work with. So speak to the team. What criteria works for them for the type of products that they need? Make sure it’s a product fit for the hotel as well as the team.
Ryan Haynes: [00:20:37] Define that buying process. What steps are you going to put in place to make sure that you find the right buyer? Sit down first and plan that path of attack. Get a bit of insight from suppliers about their level of industry experience and the credibility for that, because there are so many suppliers out there that are cross-industry that it may not work specifically for hotel and hospitality. And there are so many systems like that, particularly, for example, CRM. You know, most hotels don’t touch the big boys like the Hubspot’s or the Salesforce out there because they do not deliver what a hospitality specialised CRM actually delivers for the overall hospitality stay experience. Look at the roadmap. What is the investment the supplier is making in their technology? Make sure that they are vocal about where they’re going to be investing in that, because they may not necessarily have the tool for you today, but in six months it might be the perfect fit. So be clear on what you can expect. And then, Robin, as we’ve already said, that customer service, that support, that account management, is there someone to call when there’s a problem?
Robin Trimingham: [00:21:45] And think the best point that you made, and they were all good points, was the one about the team buy, in because I’m sure everybody listening is dealing with an individual or a department that is doing everything in the world to avoid using the new system or the system upgrade because they feel it was forced upon them. And so they’re very quietly, very secretly scurrying around in the background, entering data into the old product and avoiding doing everything they can to avoid letting management know that that’s how they’re handling things, because that is how they maintain their perceived sense of control over the situation, over their job. Yeah, everything moves forward with team buy in and everything falls apart when you don’t have it. It doesn’t matter how big or how small your operation really is. So keeping in mind that best price is not always best value when it comes to a product or particularly an IT solution. What does a hotelier need to think about, or what steps do they need to take to ensure that the quality and the viability of this thing they’re thinking of taking on for their individual operation?
Ryan Haynes: [00:23:10] Well, firstly, look at the proof. What are the examples for other types of properties that this supplier has worked with? Make sure you get maybe a list of those, or you can speak to some of those customers because at the end of the day, if you are comparing yourself with a 1000 room hotel to a 15 bed, they’re two completely different entities. So you need to make sure that the categories that this supplier works with understands your needs. Scalability, particularly if you’re a portfolio brand, does it help you grow or will it be able to service multiple properties? And how does that work? Relationships with existing systems. And this is a big thing. Every hotelier I speak to today says integrations, integrations, integrations. If your system does not integrate, what’s the point? And that is really key. Make sure that it either integrates with your existing systems or if you’re planning on changing your systems, that they integrate with one another. Accessibility. I know you mentioned you reinforced that point about the team and team buy in. Is it accessible to staff? Can it be utilized through the cloud and remotely through mobile? With housekeeping potentially being on the basement and the first floor being 32, then how do you communicate between the two? Speaking to one hotelier a couple of weeks ago who was talking about the joys of having a remote cloud system because her staff don’t have to be climbing 4 or 5 flights of stairs in 40 degree heat. They can actually do a lot of the reporting through IoT devices now, and it’s all there for them. It saves them time and it saves them the distress of having to as, say, climb all those stairs and go in to visit the rooms to see how they are. So they’re the sort of key areas that I would suggest when it comes to identifying the quality and reliability of your products.
Robin Trimingham: [00:24:58] So let’s talk about sustainability here because particularly for larger brands, everybody is talking about ESG initiatives and reporting and inclusion and all of that. As a rule, what would you recommend? What sort of questions should a hotelier ask regarding a vendor’s sustainability polilocy? Ethical sourcing, social responsibility, all of those good things.
Ryan Haynes: [00:25:29] I mean, absolutely, it’s so important. It’s on the forefront of people’s minds at the moment. Customers and guests are much more aware, and they’re considering where money is being spent and holding the right values. And also your staff will be conscious as to where the money’s being spent. So some particular questions that I’d say hoteliers should be asking vendors is the carbon footprint. So how is the product sourced? What is the supply chain. What is the level of energy that’s particularly being used or required to utilize that software or system? The key area is for us is security and data policies today. Is it safe? Does it meet requirements for your market and in particular your guests? Because they might not necessarily be from your territory, but you need to be mindful of where your guests are based to secure their data, particularly, say, Europe’s GDPR. And then how is that data stored and managed effectively, employment and modern slavery laws? I think these are certainly becoming much more under the magnifying glass, unbelievably, really, after all this time. But it’s much more consideration now as to how people are treated. And then as an industry, we’re part of the tourism and travel. So as a good employer, what are we thinking about our contribution to the overall carbon footprints, but also to bring on that younger generation of staff and guests? How can we be thinking about what their requirements are, particularly around sourcing and local vendors, and what value that will really add in the long term?
Robin Trimingham: [00:27:05] I’m going to go back to one small point that you made that I think is actually huge for a boutique operator. When we’re talking about carbon footprint, an individual operator has a real chance of reaching carbon neutrality on site because they can pivot, they can put in new processes much easier than a brand can across hundreds of hotels. But when you’re dealing with your vendors, you really need to be aware of the enormous size of the server farm that some of these vendors for IT products actually have, and the amount of carbon that these server farms are actually generating. Yes, an argument to be made that a boutique operator might be better served by going with a slightly smaller vendor.
Ryan Haynes: [00:27:57] I mean. I think a big question I have been asking now all the technology forums, is this how we considering the impact of data farms and the energy required, and where are they do have is there policies in place and at the moment.
Robin Trimingham: [00:28:12] Setting all of that?
Ryan Haynes: [00:28:13] Yeah, yeah. At the moment it’s surprising how few have really thought about that, because we’ve already seen emails as better than using paper and chopping down trees. But we’re starting to realize, actually, no, it’s not. The amount of data that we’re holding now is requiring so much energy, and it’s being duplicated multiple times across different data centers that actually we’re quadrupling the amount of energy that we are using. So certainly think as an industry, we now need to start asking those questions to technology companies. And technology companies need to start deciphering what their policy is and how they can support the overall contribution that they are providing, providing to this carbon issue that we’re facing.
Robin Trimingham: [00:28:54] Yeah, it’s the chaos theory, which is loosely that a butterfly flaps its wings in one country, and the ultimate result is an earthquake on the other side of the world. It’s an interesting time that we’re living in, so we are starting to run out of time here. But think the next question is actually really important when we’re talking about new vendors. What are some of the common clauses that you should? I’m going to say watch out for when you’re signing a new vendor agreement, because a while ago you were talking about some of these contracts going on for 5 or 7 years. And is that in any way negotiable, if you know what you’re doing?
Ryan Haynes: [00:29:38] I mean, I’m no legal expert, okay. And the agreement should definitely be reviewed.
Robin Trimingham: [00:29:42] Yeah, of course. Me neither.
Ryan Haynes: [00:29:44] Get reviewed by the IT and the product manager and the lawyer.
Robin Trimingham: [00:29:49] But based on you experience.
Ryan Haynes: [00:29:51] It’s think licenses and user rights is really important to understand because it can be based on three users or it can be based on 100 users. You might have a limitation on how many people can use them. Subscription services is it’s based in the cloud, which is often a monthly subscription. Are there commission costs involved? You also need to be clear if there’s going to be any extra costs for implementation. And what are those costs for development if necessary as well. Mention the security thing. So regulatory compliance, particularly around payment information, be very clear what that means for your hotel. And I would say what’s always important is when you’re going through the contract stage, keep going back to your original scope and ensure that it meets your needs and expectations. Good point, because there are reasons. Sometimes you might go, yes, I will go with this partner for 5 to 7 years because it makes business sense. It provides an element of continuity and stability, particularly if you’re working with a Wi-Fi system or a property management system or a finance system. But just be clear that that’s an agreement that all of you can make within the team, and that’s in the best interests of the property.
Robin Trimingham: [00:31:04] I think that’s some excellent ideas. How would you suggest that you tackle non-compliance with a vendor?
Ryan Haynes: [00:31:15] The simple things really, I guess four things that I would look at here. First one is keeping a record of communication, particularly with the account manager that you have on the supplier side. Secondly, ensure that expectations are clearly communicated and timelines given. Third, request regular updates on that process to make sure you understand what each party is doing about it. And finally, if necessary, you may need to bring in a specialist, and a specialist will definitely be able to guide you confidently through the process.
Robin Trimingham: [00:31:47] Yeah, I think that’s a good idea because and the end of the day, no reasonable vendor who wants to stay in business is going to be able to do that by ignoring real problems with real clients. So I would say in a lot of situations, there probably is a way through whatever is the mess that you’re dealing with, but you may actually need to get some extra help in order to achieve that. We have 1 or 2 minutes left here. How important do you feel it is for hotelier to keep track of market trends and keep an eye out for new suppliers that may offer better products, or new services that better suit your hotel.
Ryan Haynes: [00:32:32] Well, when I speak to hoteliers, this is one of the prime questions that I always ask and want to know from them, as well as to what gives them the value and industry events, conferences, being there with your peers, hearing what they have to say, sharing those experiences, networking as often as possible. You can listen to the suppliers, you can listen to the innovators. And I think that gives you some insight as to where the industry is going. It identifies some of the new features and functionality that’s coming out on the market. But until it’s had its proof, don’t jump ship just yet. I think it’s important to listen to guest expectations, identify any issues that they’re facing with the technology, get that satisfaction level, and maybe explore with them a bit more through focus groups as to what they would like to see. And last but certainly not least, is your staff, right? So the more you hear about their experiences and identify their issues, listen to the younger generation coming up through what would they like to see? What ideas do they have? Even the older generation that are rejoining the workforce, we’ve all adapted digitally over the last 3 or 4 years that those who were technophobic in the past are now grasping their phones and using it on a day to day basis. So think about really how you can involve all those key people, from your suppliers to the technology industry, to your peers, guests and staff to really keep on track with market trends?
Robin Trimingham: [00:34:03] I think that’s a good place to leave it. Brian, I want to thank you so much for joining me today. You’ve been listening to The Innovative Hotelier. Join us again soon for more up to the minute insights and information specifically for the hotel and hospitality industry. You’ve been listening to the Innovative Hotelier podcast by hotels magazine. Join us again soon for more conversations with hospitality industry thought leaders.